Hello everyone! Today I’m going over George R. R. Martin’s initial plan for the series and the scrapped five-year gap. What do you think? Is there anything I missed? What do you think of #houseofthedragon so far? Be sure to leave a comment, as well as like the video and subscribe if you enjoy. More #asoiaf content is on the way!
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00:00 GRRM’s Original Plan
01:26 A Change of Plans
02:12 Characters Improved by a 5-Year Story Gap
05:48 Characters Hurt by a 5-Year Story Gap
08:23 An Interesting Case
09:20 Why Was the Gap Scrapped?
10:16 Conclusions
34 Comments
the gap is the only way that the aria gendry thing would have worked
I think a big issue with the 5 year gap and Jon is the whole free folk issue. It would be hard to believe that they'd just sit around outside the wall for 5 years.
Even if Jons story was changed and he let them through at the end of Stor, it would be strange for them to live at the wall with nothing significant happening.
Yo you go crazy man! Keep up the good work!
I hate to be a naysayer, but all of these points have been talked to death in the ten years since ADWD. Juice ain't worth the squeeze
While I definitely didn't come up with this idea, I know a lot of people theorize that Darkstar/Gerold Dayne was added to fill the role that Edric Dayne was meant to play had the 5 year gap happened. He's 12ish so a gallant 17-year old knight of House Dayne taking up Dawn would've been pretty sick.
Maybe we will get it midway through the winds of winter?
Initially, I hated the idea of the 5 year jump, however, after watching House of the Dragon and its time jumps left, right and centre, it didn't really bother me there, so I now wish Gurm would have done it in writing too, that was probably our only chance of ever seeing this story completed, and he's thrown it out the window.
I think the biggest problem with the gap would have been the drastic changes in the characters without showing how they got there. Arya would have gone from a little girl who was just trying to get home to being a trained killer. Bran would suddenly be someone who could see deep into the past without the small steps, that for me, are vital clues. We also would have lost the whole Winterfell plot. For me the two worst affected characters would be Brienne and Jamie. Brienne's travels are one of my favourite parts of the series. And it was on Jamie's trip through the Riverlands that we see him for who he truly is, one of the smartest people in the story.
This might be an unpopular opinion, but I think that Stark children (minus Jon) and Dany were hurt by removal of 5 year gap. Their chapters felt meandering, slow and less interesting in comparison to other POV's in last two books. Despite that, I still think that George made the right call because more interesting bunch (Jon, Tyrion, Jaime, Cersei and Theon) kept the flow of their stories and their chapters were still a very fun read (even though Jon's and Tyrion's dragged at few points).
Anyway, unrelated to this video, what do you think about possibility that Euron Greyjoy is just a (dangerous) fraud and that his whole God scheme is nothing but charade? I say that because his plan (and theories surrounding it) seems a little too extreme compared to other fantasy elements which are (mostly) very grounded in reality, and it just seems weird and suspicious to me that George would pull out something like that. I think that could be a subject worth exploring in a future video.
i wonder, since the povs ended up split into two books anyways, would it have worked if grrm put all the povs that couldn't handle the gap in book 4 and the rest in book 5 and put the gap in between? maybe the gap could have been less, like 3 years, with book 4 covering 2 years. i'm sure others have thought of that, but i just finished a storm of swords last week so this is the first video i'm watching about the gap
He should have made Jon only get elected after the gap. A 16 year old being elected leader by a bunch of grown men and old men makes no sense.
Arianna Martell's juvenile, failed rebellion or really the whole Faith/High Sparrow storyline feel a bit tagged on. Probably could have been cut. Sam studying to become a maester really needed the Gap as well, especialy how he barely arrived in AFFC. He really needs years there to become a proper maester.
Loving these videos.
One thing I've not seen said online so much is where did this idea of a gap even come from, and I think it came from his experience with the 3-part novella "Windhaven." It's single novel broken into the three shorter novellas with major time jumps between them. It's a far less sprawling story so that's what made it manageable. I really enjoyed it. Overall, I think you are right on who benefited and who was hurt. Stannis is almost an insurmountable issue. I think the others could be reworked.
George the Gardener? I likey.
I think the time gap would have hurt the Ironborn. Whether they wait five years to hold a Kingsmoot after Balon dies in Storm, or Euron sits on his ass for five years, nether really fits IMO
I wonder if it would have been better to have a smaller gap. Maybe 2 or 3 years at most in order to give character some time to develop between books but not so long it would make writing certain plotlines difficult.
Jon Snow's been claiming the Others are back for the past five years, and nothing's happened. I'm glad I ignored all his pleas for help.
I think Dorne would’ve been severely weakened by a five year gap. It’s hard to see the Sand Snakes and maybe Arianne twiddling their thumbs after Oberyn dies. I think it would be really unsatisfying to simply be told that the Reach destroyed Dorne when some of the houses attacked. Also, the Ironborn is mixed imo. I could imagine Victorian chilling at Moat Cailin for 5 years, but I think that factors into whatever Stannis and the Boltons are doing.
I personally dont think Winds will ever get released. Regardless, George created an amazing world and story.
I rather not having year gaps in the story, is much more interesting how things come to be little by little.
Because of the gap I just disregard all of the stark children’s ages and add like 5-7 years. Aryas age is not canon!
who gives a shit at this point. those books are never getting finished.
I gave up on him when he basically told the fans they could get fcked because he had a movie to make. I even bought all his books to that point and now have refused to even watch any of the game of thrones. The fans who made him famous he screwed us over. He can kiss my hairy ass before I ever buy or read any of his books.
An alternative would have been the HotD approach: instead of one big time jump several smaller time jumps to fill the gap and show the character development.
I also think the Lady Stoneheart and Jeyne Westerling plotlines would've probably been hurt, especially if Jeyne is pregnant as some speculate.
I like the Dornish mess, but I think most would’ve preferred a 5-year gap Dorne. It probably would’ve been a smaller set-up, to keep it in line the test of the action.
Danerys would have gone to asshai in this 5 year gap
Would it be better if the five years gap were split into two or three gaps? Each would be one or two years??
My understanding was that Feast+Dance was the five year gap. Meaning their story would have taken place during the gap but revealed in memory/flashback in manner similar to how the reader learns about Robert's rebellion. But instead of five years worth of events it wound up taking only one year to transpire. George had made comments about how the story of those books needed to be told, implying that he might have passed over then had he used a time jump. At least that's what I remember, I could be mistaken.
Very glad George dropped it, I don't think it would have improved any of the Stark kids, only Dany is really served by it and even then it's better to see things than be told them.
It could never have worked. Martin has too many POVs and the books got bloated. He can't keep up with it all. When you make your series about the small details you have to keep providing those details. The characters should have been ages up in the beginning.
Hahaha it sounds like you’re saying “books” like he does
Guys, GRRM "changed" the whole story after cancelling the 5-year gap thing. So there is no point in saying "yeah, it would be bad because now character X is doing Y and it would be bad if we had a gap" because if we had a gap, the story wouldnt be like this in the beginning.
The exact reason why GRRM did skip the gap is what you say, literally. He decided to leave the gap and "fill" it instead. So all the things you propose as an excuse to not have a gap are written "after" he decided to not take a "5-year gap" filler time.
Cancelling "gap" first,
Then comes the stories and new branches etc.
Simple as that.